Karna & Arjuna

Most of the times fans of these two legendry archers are keep arguing on which one had upper hand. In terms of archery it’s a tough call between these two as Krishna/Bhisma praised both. And Krishna also knows that without his help Arjuna can’t win over Karna. But in terms of character Karna win quite easily. Whoever read Mahabharata falls in love with character of Karna. People says that despite his great character Karna fought for evil but try to put yourselves in shoes of Karna and try to judge his decisions. When whole world was standing against you a person comes and help you and treat you as his own brother would you live him in hour of need, would you? And Mahabharata war is a war of greed not a war of need. Suyodhana wasn’t a bad king and neither anyone can deny the right of Suyodhana on the throne of Hastinapur. There are few misdeeds done by Suyodhana and he was way ahead in terms of evil in compare to Pandavas. But after Mahabharata war Pandavas left Suyodhana way behind in terms of evil. So it’s also hard to decide who is evil.

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85 thoughts on “Karna & Arjuna

  1. @NIRAJ Authenciaty of vyas original mahabharat by km ganguly:


    KM ganguly was THE FIRST & TILL NOW,THE ONLY ONE WHO HAD DONE THE COMPLETE TRANSLATION OF MAHABHARAT IN ENGLISH LANGUAGE & IS THE ONLY TRANSLATION OF ITS KIND THAT FOLLOWS CROSS LINKED WORD TO WORD TRANSLATION OF SANSKRIT LANGUAGE INTO ENGLISH!Till date no one except KM Ganguly has managed to do the complete translation of Mahabharata in English Language & you can verify on internet!His translation was published between 1883 and 1896..Seconly as you all know whenever a book is published,the book undergoes a series of REVISIONS time & again untill it is finally accepted as ‘error free’ enough to be followed by students!Similar is the case with KM Ganguly’s Translation!Ganguly’s translation had undergone hundreds of revisions from 1896 till it was finally accepted as ‘error free’ & is now available on all leading Spiritual & famous religious sites!Some of these are:









  2. hey guys.. I know this debate about The Karna and Arjuna is very interesting and we all hv our own opinions.. my personal opinion is that KARNA was The best than Arjuna.. y?? see following points..
    1. about dropadi n karna.. during her wedding time she actually said to karna that not to take part in it as he was sutputra.. ( now think any girl called u @**h0|* in front of thousands of ppl what will u do its obvious Ur going to take its revenge rt??) that’s what he done during her vastra haran.. he humiliated her.. for his revenge..
    2. about abhimanyu n karna.. till 10th day of battle karna was not in the battle.. coz of bhishmas order (they hv sm problem).. on 12 or 13th day abhimanyu got killed at that time drona was the leader and he order yudhishiteers execution by chakra vue but that child got captured alone (coz only he other than Arjuna know how to penetrate it) and then he was killed by duryodhans son and not karna.. all others including drona was responsible only to injured him n not to kill him… (I don’t kn if anybody knows or what that karnas son was killed by abhimanyu hence karna took part in his assassination)
    3. about karnas kavach kundals.. when Indra took it that started the equal battle between Arjuna n karna rt?? what rubbish was that.. you all know that till last date of battle hanumanjee and krushna both made a protective shield around arjunas chariot.. otherwise arjunas chariot would hv been gone in ashes on the 1st day of battle..
    4. about dharma n adharma.. a) where was your dharma when karna was left in river alone. b) where was your dharma when he was humiliated by so many ppl still knowing the truth abut him. c) where was your dhrma when her husband played her in game. d) where was your dharma when a lady is getting insulted in public n no one is protecting her. e) where was your dharma when a lady talk to there fatherly ppl as if they are @**h0|*s…
    5. abut powers of both.. that to all of us know karna n Arjuna both knew abut bhramastra.. but Arjuna didn’t know abut shaki astra he just heard abut it n karna kn how to opratet it.. n finally Arjuna was self proclaimed best dhanurdharya who’s ego was brought down by (I forgot the name).. feeling sleepy now gud night..

  3. For all karna’s Fans:


    Incident 1:Karna fled from battlefield from Arjuna(Virata Yudh):


    Incident 2:Karna defeated by Gandharwa chitrasena:



    Incident 3:Arjuna defeat Ghandarwas & rescued Duryodhan & kurus:



    Incident 4:Karna defeated & freightened by Abhimanyu in chakruvyuhu:

    Hearing these words, Karna, afflicted with the shafts of Arjuna’s son, once more said unto Drona, ‘Exceedingly afflicted with the shafts of Abhimanyu, I am staying in battle, only because (as a warrior) I should stay here. Indeed, the arrows of this south of great energy are exceedingly fierce. Terrible as they are and possessed of the energy of fire, these arrows are weakening my heart.’


    What Karna’s own friend Ashwathama & kripacharya think of karna:



    what Lord Krishna think of karna’s bravery:

    Krishna said(To Arjuna):.I swear by Truth to thee, O friend, that my limbs are burning at the thought that while the son of Subhadra was thus advancing, consuming the hostile army with his shafts, even on that occasion the wicked-souled Karna was engaged in acts of hostility to that hero,Unable, O Partha, to stay in that battle before Abhimanyu’s face, mangled with the shafts of Subhadra’s son, deprived of consciousness, and bathed in blood, Karna drew deep breaths, inflamed with rage. At last, afflicted with arrows, he was obliged to turn his back upon the field.


    & Finally karna himself accepting Arjuna’s supeority:


    “‘Karna said(about Arjuna), “As far as I have heard,
    such a superior car-warrior has
    never been born on earth! Behold
    my prowess, since I will contend in
    battle with even that Partha who is
    such. This prince of Kuru’s line, this
    foremost of car-warriors, careers in
    battle, borne by his steeds white in
    hue. Perhaps he will despatch me to
    Yama’s abode today. Know, however,
    that with Karna’s death, these all
    will be exterminated. The two arms
    of this prince are never covered with
    sweat. They never tremble. They are
    massive and covered with cicatrices.
    Firm in the use of weapons, he is
    possessed of great skill and endued
    with great lightness of hands.
    Indeed, there is no warrior equal to
    the son of Pandu. He taketh a large
    number of arrows and shooteth them
    as if they were one. Quickly fixing
    them on the bow-string, he
    propelleth them to the distance of
    two miles. They always fall on the
    foe. What warriors is there on earth
    that is equal to him? That Atiratha,
    endued with great activity, with
    Krishna as his ally, gratified the god
    Agni at Khandava. There, on that
    occasion, the high-souled Krishna
    obtained his discus, and Savyasaci,
    the son of Pandu, obtained his bow
    Gandiva. There that mighty-armed
    one, endued with might that knows
    no decay, also obtained his terrible
    car unto which are yoked those white
    steeds, as also his two great
    celestial and inexhaustible quivers,
    and many celestial weapons, from
    the God of Fire. In the region of
    Indra he obtained his conch
    Devadatta and slew innumerable
    Daityas, and all the Kalakeyas. Who
    is there on earth that is superior to
    him? Possessed of greatness of soul,
    he gratified Mahadeva himself in fair
    fight, and obtained from him the
    terrible and mighty weapon Pasupata
    that is capable of destroying the
    three worlds. The several Regents of
    the world, united together gave him
    their weapons of immeasurable
    energy, with which that lion among
    men quickly destroyed in battle
    those united Asuras, the

    So also, in Virata’s city,
    moving on a single car he
    vanquished all of us, and snatched
    from us that wealth of kine, and took
    from all the foremost of car-warriors
    (portions of) their garments.
    Challenging that foremost of
    Kshatriyas, that hero having him of
    Vrishni’s race for his ally, that
    warrior who is endued with such
    energy and such attributes, I regard
    myself, O Shalya, to be the foremost
    of persons in all the world in point
    of courage. He is, again, protected by
    that Keshava of great energy, who i
    Narayana himself and who is without
    a rival, that high-souled Vasudeva,
    that ever-victorious Vishnu armed
    with conch, discus, and mace, whose
    attributes all the world united
    together, cannot (in narrating)
    exhaust in 10,000 years. Beholding
    the two Krishnas together on the
    same car, fear entereth my heart
    together with courage. Partha is the
    foremost of all bowmen!

    Source:origial mahabharat by vyas..trans by km ganguly!







    Authenciaty of vyas original mahabharat by km ganguly:




    Misconception No 1-Indra made Karna weaker by requesting karna to offer his kavach kundal as alms(Daan):

    About the kavach kundal of karna better get to know that even if shakuni or even blind dhritrashtra had that kavach kundal nobody not even demigods can penetrate his kavach..the fact ofthe matter is that having impenetrable kavach kundal makes karna invincible in battle & battle will become one sided so karna having deprived of his kavach kundal makes the battle equally challenging for both karna & arjuna & not one sided…So having kavacha kundal will definietly make you invincible in battle but wont show your archery talent!So having or not having kavach kundaal does’nt make you great archer & it simply weaken your defence & most important of all it doesn’t show your archery talent!!

    Misconception No 2-Kunti saved Arjuna:Moreover I laugh at somebody claim that kunti saved arjuna even though karna only promised to kunti he would spare all 4 pandavas except Arjuna as Karna was determined to kill Arjuna even though knowing Arjuna was his younger uterine brother..On the other gand arjuna gandiva fell from his hand & he cried for fraticide he had done after karna death after kunti desclosed of karna reality as his elder brother to arjuna & after dat Arjuna developed great affection for karna last suviving son named Vrishaketu, & personally arjuna trained him & took utmost care of him.. This is Arjuna!!

    Misconception No 3-Brahmin’s curse caused Karna’s defeat:

    Now coming at somebody’s claim that brahmin curse for karna..Let me tell you Arjuna didnt gave him that shap so why you blame arjuna..it was his destiny that even Arjuna cant change..in gitaopdesh lord vasudev showed arjuna his vishwaroopam in which karna alongwith all kaurava commanders were engulfed by lord krishna bigg mouth which arjuna saw..everybody knew those on path of adharm are sure to get defeated & stop blaming arjuna for that!

    Misconception No 4-Arjuna did Adharm by cheatfully killing Bhishma:

    you all are wrong again mate…If you read mahabharata properly Shikhandi in her previous birth as Amba has a boon from lord Shiva that in her next birth as shikhandi,she will be the reason for Bhishma death & Krishna himeslf enginered Bhishma death by arranging Shikandi behind Arjuna after Bhishma himself told the way of his death to pandavas..so u all better stop blaiming Arjuna for that..this was lord shiva boon that was bound to happen.& according to u Arjuna causing Bhishma death was unjust..but dear it was again lord Shiva boon that Shikandi obtained in her previous birth & dats the truth which ur ego cant change!This was bound to happenn..& if you still call this as Adharm then better blame lord shiva & lord krishna both..argue with gods then..u can assume however whatever u want in ur own version of mahabharata written by urself!but in actual mb,sorry mate dis doesnt happen dude.. accept that!

    Misconception No 5-Karna forgot Mantra due to Parshuram’s curse:

    Now coming to your point dat karna forgot mantra for brahmastra invocation..better read the last part sec 90-91 of Karna Parva. It was CLEARLY mentioned that Karna after initial struggle karna was able to recall mantra for brahmastra which he invoked & directed at arjuna which was quenched by another Brahmastra fired by Arjuna..

    Misconception No 6-Arjuna being the greatest archer cant defeat Drona & Drona has to be killed by Adharm:

    First of all if you all read Mahabharat properly in Drona Parva you will get to know that Dronacharya has invoked a terrible weapon nullyfying divine system known as “BRAHMADANDA” also called the stick of Brahma..It wasn’t actually a weapon for offensive purpose but its for defence purposes only & it has the divine power of all 7 Saptarishis & it literally nullified all weapons of Pandavas..It has the power to nullify the Brahmastra also as once Brahmastra of Great Sage Vishwamitra was nullified by Brahmadanda only!!At last Lord Krishna adviced Pandavas the way which was indeed not dharmic to kill drona but remember Drona also was the chief responsible for Abhimanyu’s merciless cowardly killing by Adharm even though he was the only eldest & most respected person after Bhishma’s fall..So he has to receive back the fruit of his actions!



    karna himself praised arjuna that everytime he cut thread of bow arjuna in such a speed rejoin his thread that karna cant notice..this is clearly memtioned in karna parva..for god’s sake read carefully..Moreover Arjuna wasnt responsible for karna shaap so why do u blame arjuna..why dont you people dont notice how abhimanyu single handedly hold at bay 5 kaurava generals simultaneously including karna when he was chariotless!!

    Moreover karna himself said to kunti(in ved vyas version) & to shalya ( in some telugu version) dat anybody except Mahadev Shiva would fear to fight arjuna wid krishna as his charioteer!

    Arjuna didnt use the irrestible & unfailing “Pashupata Astra” on karna & neither Arjuna used the deadly “Brahmasirha astra” on karna because it will have caused unimmaginable destruction which Arjuna was against..Surely karna would have dispatched to yamaloka if pashupatastra or brahmasirhastra was used on karna!!

    Karna also failed to stop Arjuna from killing Jayadratha(The person responsile for Abhimanyu’s killing)

    Even Satyaki & Bheem gave sleepless nights to Karna!

    Arjuna wasnt even seduced by queen of all Apsaras Urvashi whom even great rishis cant resist..Arjuna has an unmatched control of lust & respect for women which draupadi & krishna themselves praised!But what karna did-Karna encouraged cheer haran of draupadi & called draupadi A PROSTITUTE(VAISHYA)..God Krishna doesnt like anybody without any reason!!

    Indeed Karna was the greatest human being that took birth on Earth & this was accpted by Lord Krisna himself & his daanvir nature & absolute loyality & friendship to Duryodhan was widely praised in three worlds & he also has to undergo great miseries & humiliation as “Suta Putra” & was denied his basic rights & motherly love & I am not doubting on his moral character indeed!But as far as arhery was concerned he was definietly a step behind Arjuna as Arjuna himself was NARA(Arjuna & Lord Krishna was called as NARA NARAYANA)..So nobody in three world could beat him..

    So please stop unnecessarily criticising Arjuna everytime on public domain & stop giving sympathy votes to Karna!

    Jai Hind..

    1. That was the longest piece of junk that I have ever read. Obviously, didn’t read all of it because one can only take so much junk at a time. So, now Arjun is superior to Lord Shiv too? What garbage. Lord Shiv is God, Arjun is junk. There is simply no comparison. Arjun lobby can post all they like but it doesn’t make it true. In another thread, I posted that Arjun lovers can stoop to any low and this is as low as it can get.

      And, this one got me laughing on my a$$ – “Arjun is the perfect nara”, what next? Arjun, in his previous life, was Einstein or Mozart or Steve Jobs? lol. Arjun was a junkyard fellow with no special qualities of his own – without Lord Krishna this PoS was a nobody, just some kgs of excreta. Oh, and the less said about his dad, Indra, the better.

      1. Thozar,
        Your language shows you have lost the argument and hence have descended to such gutter language.
        Facts are facts. Aniket had highlighted these in ample detail. In your pathological hatred for the Pandavas, Arjun especially, you have lost the ability to see facts as they are. Karna lost to Arjun twice before the Kurushetra war. Both those times Krushna wasn’t there. In the Kurushetra war, Karna fought less than half the time of Arjun and still lost.
        Karna was a disappointment to his father because he supported adharma. For this reason Surya does not side with Karna. Indra sides with Arjun because he was on the side of Dharma.
        Arjun kept up his practice and kept learning from new sources. Karna sat on his laurels and learned nothing new after becoming the king of Anga.

        You can hate Arjun or Krushna or anyone you like. But atleast be aware of facts and know that for all his potential, Karna turned out to be full of hot air, promising much and delivering very little.

        If you are interested in facts, I have several articles on Karna on my site – http://www.pushti-marg.net/bhagwat/Mahabharata/maha-characters.htm

        1. BHAI SAAP
          you said that KARNA said that ARJUNA is going to abode him to yama
          it is not ARJUNA’S greatness KARNA got a dream on the day of his death that in the dream” LORD PARASURAMA appeared and said that his curse have been removed but he must die that day because DURYODHANA shouldn’t win the WAR so KARNA accepted it ..
          ARJUNA chariot
          It was mounted by HANUMAN he has been protecting it from all DIVYASTRAS
          KRISHNA saved ARJUNA trice not only from KARNA but also from another warrior during the day of ABHIMANYU’S death
          He has got a better protection than rest others in battle
          after battle when LORD KRISHNA ordered Arjuna to get down from the chariot it burst down into pieces which says nothing can escape the wrath of warriors like KARNA and BHISHMA etc..
          KARNA gave a word to kunti that he will not use same astra twice on ARJUNA
          KARNA defeated mightyBHIMSEN in a sphere fight which is impossible for ARJUNA
          ARJUNA did use PASUPATASTRA on KARNA to slay him, after he got VISHWAROOPA darshan from LORD KRISHNA ,,ARJUNA’S arrows were not able to kill him
          he is as equally powerful as BHIMSEN
          KARNA’S funeral was done by LORD KRISHNA with all his friends and family like DURYODHANA and PANDAVAS
          ARJUNA died in the hands of his son later ressuructed by his wife, for once
          he died on his way to Himalayas for peace he didn’t even get proper funeral
          KARNA’S death is still an effect to girls ,it will be an effect for centuaries
          ARJUNA too participated in brutal killing of MAHARATHA VRISHASENA a son of KARNA ,he defeated NAKULA and BHIMASEN
          In an attempt to save satyaki he even shot BAHUARSHIS from back side
          ARJUNA is just ADIRATHA but KARNA is MAHARATHA
          ARJUNA is excellent in only archery but KARNA in all types of fights
          IN INTERNET every writes short versions which gives missimages and miss conceptions
          EVEN Krishna once said that hundreds of ARJUNA’S can’t even kill one KARNA
          admit it KARNA has always a step ahead of KARNA
          MAHAMUNI VEDAVYASA potrayed PANDAVAS well but
          read BHEEL MAHABARATHA u w’ll learn more about KARNA

    2. sorry dude I am not in your site.Karna is the best because there are lot of reason and the main reason is if karna is not greater than arjun then why krishna forced to arjun to killed karna when he was nishastra

      1. If you sit in a leaky boat, it doesn’t matter who you are – you are going to drown.
        Karna was killed because he was fighting on the side of adharma. His own karma were such that he died. His lying to Parshurama, his constant insolence to Kuru elders, his insult to Draupadi and his pathological hatred of the Pandavas was his undoing.

    3. Hmmm, very convencing, Just one question why did krishna asked arjuna to kill karna when he did not have wepons in his hands, dont tell that he killed abhimanyu , if the entire world is jumping into the gutter that dos’nt mean you also jump into it u see, specialy when arjuna was so capable to get it done without doing any adharma.

    4. Hmmm, very convencing, Just one question why did krishna asked arjuna to kill karna when he did not have wepons in his hands, dont tell that he killed abhimanyu , if the entire world is jumping into the gutter that dos’nt mean you also jump into it u see, specialy when arjuna was so capable to get it done without doing any adharma.

  4. We need to be careful about Karna. It is quite obvious that the story of Karna in Mahabharat is a moral tale of how even the greatest warriors will be defeated if they leave Dharma. If you read the Mahabharata, Arjun was the greatest warrior by the time the war started, even though Karna was better to start with. At the duel in Indraprastha, Karna is clearly superior as he has had the better Guru ( Parsurama vs Drona ????) but Karna stays at that level. There is no mention that, having been cursed by Parshurama, he had any way to gather any new Divyastras till Indra gave him the Brahmastra. Arjuna, on the other hand, went on to get the Pashupastra from Mahadev as well as the Vraunastra, Danda, Sammohini and Vajra from the Devas. He also got the Gandeeva. In short, by the time he came to power, he had superior ammunition and smarter tactics.
    As to why he could not kill Karna earlier, we forget that this was not a cops and robber game b/w a bunch of overgrown kids. The strength of the Kuru army was vastly superior in terms of no. of troops, qualities of commanders etc. and a lot of the Pandava’s effort went in fighting them off.
    Talking of Arjuna having an advantage in terms of Shri Krishna is a bit silly! The angst of some of us above seems to sugest he should hav stayed neutral and increased the TRP of the wa!!!!!

    1. Dear Pratik,

      It seems you have not read Mahabharata. So before commenting on this topic, please read this book. No duel took place between Karna and Arjuna at Indraprastha. Perhaps you are talking about Karna’s performance at rangshala in Hastinapur. At rangshala also, no duel took place between Karna and Arjuna. Karna only duplicated Arjuna’s performance with bow and arrows. He couldn’t outclass him. The first duel between above two warriors took place after Draupadi’s swayamwar, where Arjuna got the upper hand.

      How can you say that a student better just because he has got a better guru ? Duryodhana also learned archery from Drona. But he was nowhere close to Arjuna in archery. And how can you prove that Parsurama was better than Drona ? Parsurama lost to Bhishma. So it can not be said that Parsurama was a better warrior than his own pupils.

      Nobody stopped karna from learning new skills or collecting weapons. Parsurama’s didn’t say to karna that you will not be able learn any new skills now or you will not be able to collect new weapons.

        KARNA was not a beggar like ARJUNA
        KARNA is not much interested in draupadi much
        he felt embrassed to fight with eunuch like BRIHANNALA

    2. You are right, Karna rested on his laurels and never tried to better himself. Unlike Arjun, he never tried to obtain divastras and unlike Duryodhan who learned new skills from Balarama, Karna never tried to learn from anyone else.
      Though he had a lot of potential, Karna failed because he strived to improve himself.

      Karna supporters – don’t tell me he was so good he didn’t need to learn more (unlike Arjun). Karna lost in several battles, even against Arjun, yet he kept boasting or blaming his weapons or his charioteer, but never his own inefficiency or lack of skills. If Karna had the ability to introspect, he could have improved himself. But sadly, he didn’t. That’s why he wasn’t victorious, Arjun was.

  5. Finally, I got the information on how exactly Abhimanyu was killed.

    Abhimanyu was sixteen years old when he fought in the Mahābhārata war. The warriors he fought were far more experienced and seasoned than him and he exhibited courage and valor far greater than what his age, experience and training demanded.
    His most important contribution was the fact that he stood between victory and defeat of Pandavas in the war on the 13th day. Without his presence, Yudhisthira would have been captured by the Kaurava forces and the war would be lost.
    Abhimanyu entered the Chakravyu. Drona at the head of the formation was wreaking havoc with the Pandava forces. Seeing the destruction of his army, Yudhishthira asked Abhimanyu for help. Abhimanyu informed him that he knows how to enter the Chakravyu formation but not the way out. Yudhishira, Bheema, Nakul, Sahadeva, and other warriors were to follow Abhimanyu into the Chakravyu to assist him in getting out. Unfortunately, they were not able to follow him in due to Jayadratha, the king of the Sindhus who utilized a boon that he had received from Shiva to single-handedly hold off the Pandava forces for one day. Another reason that the rest of the Pandava forces could not accompany him could be that in his zeal, he rushed through the forces and did not wait for his senior colleagues to support him.
    Abhimanyu’s education began while he was still in Subhadra’s womb. So he had mastered all the kalas & vidyas in a short period as compared to even his father – Arjuna. Except he couldn’t get knowledge of exiting the Chakravyu.
    Why did Karna retreat [get defeated] from Abhimanyu? Karna had taken oath that his sole enemy was only to be Arjuna. He never wished to kill anyone else from the Pandava lineage.
    Abhimanyu was able to make return much of the maha-rathis from Kaurava side. Meanwhile, Duryodana & Karna left the battlefield to ask Drona how Abhimanyu could be killed. Drona answered –
    ‘Abhimanyu is young, his prowess is great. His coat of mail is impenetrable. This one’s father had been taught by me the method of wearing defensive armour. This subjugator of hostile towns assuredly knoweth the entire science (of wearing armour). With shafts well shot, you can, however, cut off his bow, bow-string, the reins of his steeds, the steeds themselves, and two Parshni charioteers. O mighty bowman, O son of Radha do this With his bow in hand he is incapable of being vanquished by the very gods and the Asuras together. If you wish, deprive him of his chariot, and divest him of his bow.’

    P.S – ‘O mighty bowman, O son of Radha’ = Karna

    Accordingly to Drona’s suggestions –
    In a series –
    • Karna quickly cut Abhimanyu’s bow [it is nowhere mentioned that this was done by Karna from Abhimanu’s back; it’s just shown in the TV soaps.]
    • Kritayarman killed his horses.
    • Kripacharya killed his two Parshni charioteers.
    • Bowless and chariotless, Abhimanyu, took up a sword and a shield and attacked.
    • Drona cut his sword at the hilt.
    • And later on Karna destroyed his shield.
    Abhimanyu then picked up a mace and rushed at Aswatthaman. Aswatthaman jumped out of his chariot and ran as Abhimanyu destroyed his chariot. Abhimanyu then attacked and killed Kalikeya and seven hundred and seventy of his army.
    As Arjuna was a great archer & so was Abhimanyu, similarly as Bhima, Duryodhana & Duhasasana were great with mace [gada] so was Duhasasana’s son. Abhimanyu saw in front Duhasasana’s son.
    He then attacked Duhasasana’s son and destroyed his chariot. They both knocked each other down. Duhasasana’s son got up first and hit Abhimanyu on the head, killing him in the mace fight.
    So at no point was Abhimanyu killed by many MahaRathis, though it is accepted that he was attacked by many MahaRathis to deprive him from bow & arrows & his chariot; which was there main goal.

    And also for everybody’s information –
    Details of Virata war – Why did Karna retreat [get defeated] from Arjun? First of all Arjun was disguised as eunuch. He used samohan astra & all were left unconscious. Later Arjun gave a loud twang from his Gandiva bow and blew his conch loudly. All regained conscious due to this & even realized that the eunuch was none other than Arjun. But Karna & none of the Kauravas continued the war as they had recognized the Pandavas & were more interested in punishing them by their 12 yrs exile to be started again.

    Felt interested in sharing below information with you –
    At various times during battle, the supreme commander of either army ordered special formations (“vyuhas”). Each formation had a specific purpose; some were defensive while others were offensive. Each formation had its specific strengths and weaknesses. Mahābhārata’ list the following:

    1. Krauncha vyuha (heron formation)
    2. Makara vyuha (crocodile formation)
    3. Kurma vyuha (tortoise or turtle formation)
    4. Trishula vyuha (the trident formation)
    5. Chakra vyuha (wheel or discus formation)
    6. Kamala vyuha or Padma vyuha (lotus formation)
    7. Garud vyuha (Eagle formation)
    8. Oormi vyuha (Ocean formation)
    9. Mandala vyuha (Galactic formation)
    10. Vajra vyuha (diamond/ thunderbolt formation)
    11. Shakata vyuha (Box/Chariott formation)
    12. Asura vyuha (Demon formation)
    13. Deva vyuha (Divine formation)
    14. Soochi vyuha (Needle formation)
    15. Sringataka vyuha (Horned formation)
    16. Chandrakala vyuha (Crescent/ Curved Blade formation)
    17. Suchi vyuha – Needle formation
    18. Chayana vyuha – Hawk formation
    19. Mala vyuha – Garland formation

  6. I do not believe that Karna got any curse. The stories of these curses look very funny. These stories are nothing but interpolations in Mahabharata. It seems that all the curses of the world were behind Karna.

    Shalya was a very good charioteer. The chances of Karna’s chariot getting stuck in mud were very less, yet it can not be rulled out. Karna’s chariot might have stuck in mud, but we don’t see that Karna was facing any problem in shooting arrows at Arjuna from that possition.

    According to Mahabharata, Karna asked for some time to extract the wheel of his chariot, but Arjuna refuced on the advice of Krishna and Karna again ascended on his chariot. Now Karna would not have taken the risk to extract the wheel himself. Shalya was Karna’s charioteer and he was also a very strong man. So it was the duty of Shalya to extract the wheel of that chariot. And Karna would have given him the cover by shooting arrows at Arjuna then. But if Karna and Shalya, both got unarmed then the chances of Karna getting killed was very high. Arjuna recovered very soon when Karna pierced him with a powerful arrow. It means Arjuna was not seriously injured by Karna and any attempt to extract the wheel could have been suscidal for Karna. And Karna was not a fool who would have taken such a risk.

    In my view Arjuna recovered within seconds and shoot anjalika with full force at Karna. And that arrow killed Karna before he could have countered the attack .

  7. There are also many myths regarding divyastras in Mahabharata. Drona’s brahmdand, Ashwatthama’s narayanastra, Karna’s bhargavastra and Arjuna’s pasupatastra- all seem to be interpolations in Mahabharata.

    Ashvatthama had narayanastra and brahmshir, still he could not kill Dristidyumna in the battle field. Satyaki defeated Ashvatthama and rescued Dristidyumna.

    When Ashvatthama launched narayanastra, Bhima didn’t withdraw from the battle. Narayanastra started to burn Bhima. Arjuna fired varunastra to reduce the effact of narayanastra? Was it possible ? Next we see that Krishna and Arjuna forcefully pulled down Bhima from his chariot. Will narayanastra take so much time in killing a warrior ?

    Now let us talk about bhargavastra of Karna. Karna fired bhargavastra at panchalas and pandavas on 17th day, but no panchala or pandava general got hurt. Can any warrior save himself from a irreststaible divyastra just by retreating ? No one can escape an ‘amogh astra’. Even if it was possible, Karna could have fired that weapon again when panchalas generals came back. And how Karna forgot his bhargavastra at the time of killing Ghatotkacha ? Why was he forced to fire vasva shakti to kill Ghatotkacha ? Karna again failed to kill Arjuna with bhargavastra at the time of his last battle with Arjuna.

    Arjuna had pasupatastra, still he had to fight hard to reach Jayadratha and kill him.

  8. There is a similarity in the killings of Karna, Bhishma, Drona and Duryodhana- a high voltage drama. This proves that these tales have been exaggerated later.

    As Arjuna and Karna both were great warrios, the final battle between them must have been a fierce encounter. But the way this duel has been described in Mahabharata, proves that it is an exaggerated account of that war. For example…asuras favored Karna and devas favored Arjuna….Surya was fanning Karna and Indra was fanning Arjuna…etc etc.

    Karna really gave a tough fight to Arjuna as he was very angry after the death of his son, Vrishsena that day. He was fighting an all out war with Arjuna. Both Arjuna and Karna injured each other. After some time Arjuna made Karna faint for a moment. Karna recovered soon and aimed at Arjuna’s neck. Arjuna lowered his head to avoid Karna’s arrow(nagastra) and that arrow missed Arjuna’s head by few inches. Here we can see a fabricated story in Mahabharata that says that Krishna pressed the chariot in to the ground to save Arjuna. There was no need to press the chariot, Arjuna could have produced the same result by lowering his head.

  9. Arjuna was the greatest warrior of his time but he can not defeat all the kaurava generals singly in a fair battle. Perhaps kauravas lost due to a surprise attack of Arjuna in virat war.

    Karna’s kavach and kundal is also a myth. No human can born with kavach, kundal or weapons. It is against the nature. And if Karna had those magical kavach and kundal then how did he get injured in gandharva war and in the battle with Arjuna at the time Draupadi’s swayamwar ?

    1. Anand Shankar,

      You claim may things simply because of your lack of knowledge and try to apply flawed logic to events you do not fully understand.

      If Karna’s kavach and kundalas are myth, then by that logic, Karna couldn’t have been Surya’s son either and neither any of the Pandavas could have had gods as their fathers. Additionally, further to this so called logic of yours, Ashwatthama could not have had a gem embedded in his forehead ( since it is against nature, as you put it !! ).

      Maybe you could explain / clarify just one thing for me : why was the entire Kaurava army, including Dronacharya, helpless against Ghatotkach, up until Karna was forced to use the divine “Shakti” given to him by Indra ? How can JUST ONE person be mightier than an entire army of Maharathis ?

      Can you apply your logic and give me a convincing answer ? Or you could simply call Maharshi Vyas a liar and the entire Mahabharat a work of fiction.

  10. I have no doubt that Karna was a great atirathi. But there are many myths regarding Karna in Mahabharata. It is given in Mahabharata that Karna promised to Kunti that he would not kill her sons except Arjuna. But we can see in the text that Karna was attacking Bhima with the desire to kill him on 14th day. He recalled his promise to Kunti only at the end of the duel between them. Similarly Karna almost killed Yudhishthira on 17th day. He was determined to kill an injured Yudhishthira and pierced him with many powerful arrows. He had to leave Yudhishthira to save Duryodhana, who was about to succumb to Bhima’s attack.

    Practically it is not possible to fight with any warrior without injuring him in a fierce battle like mahabharata war. We can see that Karna severely mangled Yudhishthira’s body with his arrows and there was no guarany that his arrows wouldn’t have killed Yudhishthira.

    1. Anand Shankar,

      If arrows pierce arms / legs then obviously, those injuries, however painful, are not life threatening. And since Karna is an accomplished archer, ( according to Lord Krishna’s words, even Karna could’ve won at Draupadi’s swayamvar ), he can easily aim at not-vital parts of the opponents body.

      Karna was also determined to defeat ( and did defeat ) every Pandava and spare every one of them with the exception of Arjun.

      All of your comments are illogical and poorly thought through and should be ignored.

  11. arjuna is zero without lord krishna…
    even Krishna was also said to karna that “karna..in pandavas each of 5 has different
    skills..but you are the only man who has all these 5skills are combined”
    so Karna is greatest than Arjuna……………..

    1. Sorry to correct you Athul, but Arjun won many battles without Krushna. He defeated Karna during Virat battle and defeated gandharavas who defeated Karna. Karna was a bad loser and complained a lot – I had the wrong teacher, wrong upbringing, wrong driver or weapon etc. Arjun got on with it and made the best of what he had – even an inexperienced driver in the form of Uttam the prince of Virat.

      in the Gita Krushna clearly says “I am Arjun amongst Pandavas.” Krushna would not have supported Pandavas if Karna was the better person.

    2. if you read bhagawat geetha properly krishna also said among gods i am vishnu, among men i am brahmin and among padavas i am arjuna. so from where this without krishna concept has come .. when krishna himself is saying i am arjuna. strange comment … i think your love for karna is taking you away from actual facts …

  12. I won’t disagree, Arjuna can claim the position of the Best.

    But not everyone was lucky as Arjuna also.
    Like other greats he also sometimes overrated his abilities.
    And in all the occasion Lord Krishna saved him.
    Once he challenged Lord Hanuman unknowingly,another time he swear to kill Jayadrath without giving any due to his opponents.

    Arrogance or Ignorance?
    But for his boast , he came very close to becoming a toast.

    Kichaka was Banashur,when Banashur co-existed at the same time,Kichaka died before Banashur defeat to Lord Krishna.

    Actually to make Kauravs look more evil, many authors keep on adding some thing which makes mockery of logic.

    There are many exaggeration in mahabharat like Karna pushing the Arjuna’s chariot whose Lord Krishna was charioteer.
    And whole Kaurav troop getting defeated by single Arjuna at virat, which included Karna with Kavach and Kundal intact.

    And entire Pandavas took whole 18 days to win the war.
    Quite a difference in performance?

    Another twist is that Both Lord Krishna and Lord Indra stated Karna with his kavach Kundal is invincible.

    So the i think the original Mahabharat was distorted by both Pandava and Kaurava Followers.

    1. Smartboy, there is one correction in your post. The story of Arjuna challenging Hanuman of breaking the arrow bridge in the sea is fake and not true. It has no origin in the Puranas. It is an added story by later day folks. Karna pushing Arjuna’a chariot is also fake as you said. Drona who was on the Kaurava side was no evil but in fact incarnation of Brihaspati

  13. 1 There existed a Gandharva Sage by name Devaka; He was born as a son to Ahuka in order to perform the service of Lord Hari; He was the younger brother of Ugrasena and his name was Devaka; Devaki was born out of him.
    2 Few other wives of Sage Kashyapa were born as daughters to Devaka; Among them, Ahuka accepted the eldest one, Devaki, as his daughter; Therefore, she became Kamsa’s aunt as well as his sister.
    3 Aditi, in the form of Devaki, became the wife of Vasudeva; Kamsa himself drove the auspicious chariot during her wedding; At that time, Vayu made a statement from the skies.
    4 If he does not commit any sin against his elders, then Lord Vishnu, who will follow the rules of the world, will not find his own maternal uncle fit for being eliminated; Therefore, Vayu spoke the way he did in order to create hatred over Lord Krishna’s parents in Kamsa.
    5 “O fool! The eighth son of this Devaki will become your death” – as soon as he heard this voice, Kamsa picked up a sword; Vasudeva gave him a word about handing over his son and got her released and went home with her.
    6 Vasudeva also married the six young sisters of Devaki; Vasudeva stayed happily with them; Before that, he had married Rohini, the daughter of King Bahlika; She was his wife earlier (as Kashyapa’s wife) by name Surabhi.
    7 Vasudeva married the daughter of King of Kashi under the Putrika Putra Dharma; Similarly, he married the daughter of King Kara Veera; These two were earlier Diti and Danu.
    Note: Under the Putrika Putra Dharma, the son born out of the wedding is taken over, and taken care of, by the father of the wife in order to further the dynasty.
    8 The sinner Vena who used to think “I am Vishnu” was born as Poundraka vAsudeva; He was born to Vasudeva in the daughter of King Kashi; He used to always state – “Vishnu is not different than me”.
    9 A daitya named Dundhu, who was the son of Madhu, was born as Shrugala vAsudeva in the daughter of King Kara Veera; Once Vasudeva married Devaki, he did not go back to the two of them.
    10 Therefore, these two eldest sons of Vasudeva became the eternal enemies of the Yadavas; The all-knowing Vasudeva then had many children, who were the avataras of Devatas, from his other wives.
    11 All those with the amshas of Devatas who came down to Earth became the students of Lord Vyasa; They learnt the truth about Lord Vishnu from Him, and became knowledgeable according to their yogyata.
    12 There were six Sages who were born from Sage Marichi; Once they made fun of Sage Devala over his thin frame; Due to the curse of that Sage, they were born as Kalanemi’s sons; They also performed penances in order to become immortal.
    13 Brahma gave them that boon; Hiranyakashipu, upon getting to know that they got a boon from someone other than himself, got very angry and cursed them – “May you all be born on Earth; There, you will get killed by your own father”.
    14 Due to the inspiration from the Lord, Durga brought them over after making them lose consciousness over their bodies and put them into Devaki’s womb; Kamsa killed them.
    15 Around the same time, Pandu wished to go to the excellent assembly of Brahma, along with the company of Sages; The Sages then stopped him.
    16 A Sadhaka will never attain a good state if he doesn’t fulfill the work for which he took birth on Earth; Hence the Sages stopped him.
    17 Pandu had taken avatara in order to obtain the main Devatas by ordering his wife; Without fulfilling that, he would not obtain a good state.
    18 Otherwise people can obtain a good state even without having children; Just like how Dharmabhushana, the son of Sandhyavali, obtained a good state.
    19 Around the same time, Kali, Indrajit and other Rakshasas had entered the womb of the wife of the son of Vichitravirya (Gandhari).
    20 It was around this time that Pandu listened to those words of the Sages; Having thought over their advice, Pandu, who always had Lord Vasudeva in his mind, spoke thus to his wife (Kunti).
    21 “You obtain a son from one who is higher than me in attributes; The noble people are saying that one cannot obtain a good final state without having sons”.
    22 Kunti agreed to his orders with great difficulty; She said – “I know an excellent mantra which can make Devatas listen to me and give me sons”.
    23 “There is none equal to you other than Suras; Even amongst Devatas, only a few are equal to you; Therefore, as per your orders, which Devata higher than you shall I call?”
    24 One who has an excellent husband will not have any remedy if she engages with anyone lesser than him; She cannot reach her husband’s world.
    25 Earlier in the Kruta Yuga, the Suras never involved themselves with anyone apart from their designated wives; Similarly, the Devata ladies also never engaged with anyone apart from their own husbands.
    26 Those Devatas were always Pativratas in mind, speech and body from time immemorial; Therefore, they always used to unite only with their husbands.
    27, 28 They always obtained Mukti along with their wives; After the Kruta Yuga ended, Apsaras were born in large numbers; They never had their own husbands; They always take whomever they desire as their husbands; Therefore, they are not the ones who obtain Mukti along with their husbands.
    29 Due to strong reasons, if Devata ladies violate the rule of being with their own husbands only, then they obtain great problems which cannot be tolerated and will also lead to separation from their husbands.
    30 “Therefore, what you have instructed me is not appropriate; Still, I cannot violate your words; Therefore, who is that Devata who can give me a son? Tell me”.
    31 When she said thus, King Pandu replied – “Without Dharma, no King can rule the Earth; Therefore, you immediately call the Lord of Dharma (Yama)”.
    32 “The son born out of Dharma will be excellent and will also be very Dharmic” – when he said thus, she invited Yama; He came immediately.
    33 Kunti then immediately gave birth to an excellent son called Yudhisthira; Yama himself was born as his own son.
    34 As soon as Yama was born as Kunti’s son, Gandhari became very troubled due to jealousy; She hit her own womb.
    35 As soon as she aborted her own womb, Lord Keshava in the form of the son of Parashara came over there; He divided the foetuses and placed them in jars.
    36 The womb was divided into hundred parts and Duryodhana and others were born on every consecutive day; Dushala was born as the hundred and first.
    Note: Duryodhana was born first. Thereafter, every day, another of the brothers were born. On the 101st day, Dushala was born.
    37 In order that the Lord’s plans come true, Lord Vyasa, the One who is infinitely capable, the One who is the Lord of all, protected the foetuses that were born out of the son of Vichitravirya.
    38 Kali was born as Suyodhana and he possessed excellent strength in the shoulders; He obtained such high strength due to the presence of Mukhya Vayu in him.
    39 Earlier on the Meru mountain, the Daityas had listened to the discussion of the Devatas about taking birth on Earth.
    40 All of them had then worshipped the three-eyed one (Shiva) and had pleased him; Kali, who always troubles the Devatas, had obtained a boon that he will be invincible (cannot be killed) in any way.
    41 Due to the boon of the Lord of Uma (Shiva), Kali, the tormentor of Devatas, was born as Suyodhana with a diamond-like body and possessed great strength.
    42 After Suyodhana, the one who was invincible in any way, was born, Indrajit came out of another ghee-filled pot.
    43 He was Dushasana, the one who made rules that caused sorrow; After that Atikaya was born; He came to be known as Vikarna; After that the powerful Khara was born.
    44 He came to be known as Chitrasena; Similarly, other Rakshasas were born possessed with terrible capacities as the children of Dhritharashtra.
    45, 46 In this way, the Rakshasas, who are the personification of all defects, took birth in physical form; A Rakshasi known as Mrusha was born as Dushala; She had the presence of Kuhu; In order to cause the death of Arjuna’s son Abhimanyu, Kuhu had performed a penance to please Shiva; Hence she was born in this way.
    47 Saindhava became the reason behind Abhimanyu’s death only because of what she said; That Saindhava was a Kalakeya Danava; He was born on Earth for this very purpose.
    48 Similarly Nirruta, the brother of Nirruti got together with the Nasika Abhimani Vayu and was born as Yuyutsu.
    49 He was born of Dhritharashtra’s sperm; He was younger than Duryodhana; He was born in the womb of a Vaishya lady; He was very dear to Lord Hari.
    50 After Yudhishthira was born, Pandu said thus – “Dharma must be protected with physical and intellectual strength; Otherwise, it will be destroyed; Therefore, you immediately give birth to a son who has both these strengths”.
    51 “Among yajnas, Ashwamedha is the best; Out of all the energies that are visible to humans, Sun is the best; Out of all varnas, Brahmin is the best; Amongst Devatas, after the Supreme Being Lord Vishnu, it is Vayu who is the best in all noble attributes”.
    52 “The immeasurably valorous Lord Hari is verily my father in the form of Lord Vyasa; Therefore, he is your father-in-law; It is not appropriate to obtain a son from him; Therefore, you resort to Lord Vayu himself”.
    53 When Pandu said so, Kunti invited Vayu; Due to his mere touch, she gave birth to a son who was unmatched in the entire world in the two types of strengths and also in the devotion of Lord Vishnu.
    54 Vayu himself was born that way; Since he is the embodiment of all knowledge, he is known as Bhima; Since he is always with his Lord – Vishnu – his name is Sena; Hence he is known as Bhimasena.
    55 As soon as Bhima was born, the Earth bore some cracks; Bhima once fell down from his mother’s arms when she got scared of a tiger; The entire mountain – Shatashrunga – broke into pieces.
    56 When Bhima was born, great Asuras vomitted blood, along with their vehicles and armies; The Asuras and Rakshasas who were born as Kings were extremely scared.
    57 Bhima started growing in that forest itself and was greatly increasing the joy of Suras; At the same time, due to the order of Lord Hari, Sesha had entered the womb of Devaki.
    58 Sesha stayed in the womb of Devaki for three months and, as per the orders of Lord Hari, was transferred to the womb of Rohini by Durga Devi; He spent seven months there and was then born on Earth.
    59 He was named as Baladeva and became extremely powerful; After him Lord Janardana, the Lord of all, the main abode of infinite noble attribute, took avatara in Devaki.

  14. Hey guys did you know, Duryodhana was demon Kala incarnate who is actually Kaliyuga. Dushasan was Indrajeet. Jarasandha was demon Vipracchiti who was killed by Vayu during the Deva- Asura war. Purochan was Prahasta. Pootna was Tadaka. Drona was Brihaspati incarnate. Somadatta was Kubera incarnate. Demon Bana who was son of Bali was born as Kichaka. Aditi was born as Devaki.

    The gods incarnated themselves on the Pandava side while the Asuras and Rakshasas were born as evil kings.

  15. Arjuna lost to Babrubahan,and was killed in the fight.
    He was resurrected, by devi Ulopi. His wife, so if anybody considered Arjuna invincible, time to rethink .

    1. arjuna lost to decoits was true but his age was 128 and was near to the age of death. He doesn’t have a boon that bheeshma got from his father(iccha maran). And yes he lost to babruvahana as a result of curse from vases. but if you notice the difference arjuna accepted these truths and lived in the path of good until he died. he didn’t showed them as reasons for taking side of adharm. That is the difference between 2 warriors and that is exactly the reason why arjuna was loved by krishna and why karna had to face insults, defeats and finally death.

  16. A lot has been discussed on the eternal battle karna vs arjuna. Arjuna supporters have made their points very well. In consistency in performance Arjuna was indeed head and shoulder above Karna. But some statements are well not wrong but I would say highly subject to opinion.
    Mr. Johns statement ( “Karna may have quite a large number of divya astra but all his weapons were in no match to the Arjuna’s Brahmastra.”) I would recommend to read about Bharagava astra which may have a remote possibility to revised opinion.

  17. There is a lot of confusion here. People read Mahabharata as a story but not a a lesson.
    Lesson is read to understand and get the best out of it. Story is heard for entertainment.

    First of Arjuna or Karna, which one is greater warrior:

    1.When it comes to archery (accuracy of hitting the target) , both are equal.
    2. Agility: Arjuna was superior in agility as karna told that each time he breaks the thread of Arjuna bow, Arjuna quickly tie another thread before Karna can hit him with another arrow.
    3.Divya astra: No one can match Arjuna in entire Mahabharata (except Krishan, or Drona). for the might of Dviya astra.Arjuna know to produce bhrahmastra and call them back when needed. This made him to use brhama astra as many time as he can. NO one know this vidya acceot Arjuna (drona and krishna). Krana may have quite a large number of divya astra but all his weapons were in no match to the Arjuna’s Brahmastra. Arjuna was not great becuase he had those knowledge, he was great becaue he knows when to use them. When karna had all his divya astara failed he started using Brahmastra (but forger theverese to call it). Then arjun killed him with pashupati astra rather than brahma astra. Arjun as an individual known how to use this dangerious weapons and that is why Drona belived arjuna much more than his son. He taught his son to make bhrahamastra but did not taught him to recall it back. Its becuase the one who can recall it back can create as many bhramastar he can. So May be karna had any asta he wnat to have but arjuna had the facory of the most power fll weapons Bhrahmastra. Not only this he knew when to use them morally and for truth.
    4. Defence: no one can mathc krana for hsi armour and his ear rings, But they were takne so on battle ground Arjuna had much more superior defence (Shri Krishna) than Karna. Its Krishan who decided that he wnat to be with Arjuna. So no way you can call it unfair.
    5.Bravery: Krana was defeated by arjuna beingh a euncuh. Karna (who call himself warrior) insulted a abla woman. This is not in the nature of a true warrior. Karna was a key member of Abhimanyu assassination.Sevrral mighty warrior (including Karna) againsta a Child who even has lost his weapons.(karna broke his Bow fomr behind) Abhimnay then started fight with the broken parts of his chariot. Even to that no one was able to defet him. Then shakuni plotted to use the family emotion trick on abhimanyu and called him to hug. Than al mighty warrior killed Abhimanyu when he put down his weapons(which was the whel of his chariot).. So Abhi many the son of Arjuna was far more superior than any one in entore mahabharata when its comes to courage and breavery.

    Kanran was good but he failed to fight back aginst his fate. Warrior fight agnst this world fight aginst theri fate for maintaining jutsice annnd truth.
    Krna did not did this, Arjuna did and that is why Krishna (The god , the truth) sided with Arjuna and not with Karna(Bhisma or any other warrior).

      1. arjuna is nothing without krishna. karna on the 16th day defeated alll pandavs. even with shalya discouraging him he made an excellent fight with arjuna. karna was the only warrior arjuna feared. many accuse karna fr attacking abhimanyu. according to me abhimanyu was a secret weapon trained in dwaraka since his birth fr the impending war. he was trained personally by krishna and balram

        1. Praveen, re-read the original and get your facts straight. Arjun was fighting for 10 days straight when Karna entered the war fresh. He was still unable to defeat or harm him.
          The only reason Arjun did not finish the battle earlier is because he refused to kill his elders – Bhishma and Drona. Though he had the weapons, he refused to use them against his elders. His love for his elders stayed his hand again and again. Krushna kept reminding him about the divya-astras, but Arjun prevaricated again and again.

          Karna wasn’t as good as Arjun and though throughout the Mahabharata he keeps boasting that he was, he never proves it. He does not defeat Arjun after the swayamvar or during the Virat war and dies in the Kurushetra war.

          Karna was an empty boast.

    1. Respected John,
      Karna also had Brahmastra and had the ability to call it back.

      So did Bheesma had,
      Dronacharya always rated Bheesma better than himself.

      Infact it was Arjuna who had doubt,otherwise he won’t plead before the lord to be his charioteer .

    2. who told that Karna had no Brahmaputra? read the epic once more….and think about what was the curse of Parashuram on Karna…

  18. Read this: http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/maha/index.htm.
    I have read the complete unabridged version, tiil the end of war, and come to a simple conclusion. Arjuna is the ultimate warrior in Mahabbharata. Nobody comes even half of him. Karna is a distant fifth or sixth warrior, who manages to knock off Arjuna’s crown by Nagashtra, it is his only achievement. Apart from this incident, Arjuna defeats Karna so many times mano-a-mano, that it is hard to count. In fact, Ved Vyasa, the creator of Mahabharata, describes Karna to be one of the ‘Chaturdustam’, which means one of the ‘evil foursome’ (the other three being: Duryodhana, Duhshashana and Shakuni). Now, it is up to you to form your opinion. Afterall, none of them is alive now and not a life-and-death question for me; but I have formed my opinion after investing more than 3 months of reading a text.

    1. The translation are from Gangulys version.
      below are the confessions of Sanskrit Professor K. M. Ganguly ” The entire translation
      is practically the work of one hand. In portions of the Adi and the Sabha Parvas, I was assisted by Babu Charu Charan Mookerjee. About four forms of the Sabha Parva were done by Professor Krishna Kamal Bhattacharya, and about half a fasciculus during my illness, was done by another hand. I should however state that before passing to the printer the copy received from these gentlemen I carefully compared every sentence with the original,making such alterations as were needed for securing a uniformity of stylewith the rest of the work.
      Quoting him. I should here observe that in rendering the Mahabharata into English I have derived very little aid from the three Bengali versions that are supposed to have been executed with care. Every one of these is full of inaccuracies and blunders of every description. I cannot lay claim to infallibility. There are verses in the Mahabharata that are exceedingly difficult to construe. I have derived much aid from
      the great commentator Nilakantha. ” As you can see friends that Prof Ganguly himself mentions that he has erred and his version in his own opinion cannot be considered authentic. I admire Ganguly for his honestly but given a choice between him and Swami Vivekananda I would prefer to trust Swami Vivekananda as he was a more capable man. Swami Vivekananda has glorified Karna. Even from ganguls texts I could find him being acknowledged by Krishna as a warrior equal to Arjuna. The srimad bhagavatam glorifies karna bheesma and drona as timingila fish.
      ( however I am not sure on this I need some verification on the bhagavatam by some one who has studied it properly )

      1. It is a translation and not some fictious interpolation by KMG. Now you try to argue that KMG’s translation is not authentic and using KMG’s words as arguments. But even if he erred, his translation is the ‘closest’ to the Epic.
        And please understand the difference between translation and opinion. In forming opinion, one has more liberty, not so with translation. The errors in translation cannot change the overall tone of the text, or incidents that happen throughout the text. Karna is defeated at-least 4-5 times by Arjuna alone (Lets not talk about defeats from others such as Bhima, Abhimanyu or Gatotkachha). This cannot be put down to ‘mere translation errors’. Pick up any text, that tries to translate the verses, and you will find Arjuna coming out heads and shoulders above the rest.
        As regards comparison’s of Vivekananda and KMG, I would repeat my argument. Vivekananda is expressing his opinion, while KMG is simply translating what Vyasa had to say. And if I have to pick between Vyasa and Vivekanada, I would go with Vyasa.
        Karna may be glorified by anyone, I have no problems with that. But in Vyasa’s MB, the central characters and heroes are Pandavas.
        We don’t have any knowledge about actual lives of these heroes, so we have to rely on the Mahabharata text (originally in sanskrit) and its translations.
        Let me also say that I have nothing against Karna or Drona. Its the false stories that are invented to belittle one and glorify the other that irks me. In recent times, there have been numerous such attempts (BR Chopra’s MB serial is the biggest example), and I am completely against it. There may have been alterations in the ancient past, and the story may have been rewritten in favour of one or the other may times; but we cannot do anything about it. It’s the biased novels like ‘Mrityunjay’ that irks me most.

      1. I would agree that Arjuna never really defeats Bhishma even once, and again Bhishma also never defeats Arjuna even once. There were quite a few duels between them but both were affectionate towards each other, so its unnecessary to compare them.

        1. On the order of YUDHISTIRA, Arjuna saved DURYODHANA and his crew from YAkshni during their exile
          DURYODHANA gave them a boon
          then before the war ARJUNA asked for five arrows of BHISHMA which are meant for killing PANDAVAS

  19. accordin to me the Karna was always greater than arjuna..he is d greatest warrior in mahabharat..all of u should read d book MRUTYUNJAY by shivaji sawant n u’ll come to know how karna was superior than any other men …

    1. All have read the Mahabharata. One should not ignore the facts that Karna has suffered defeat at the hands of Arjuna and Abhimanyu. Karna was sure great but not the greatest. Bhishma was the greatest!!!!!!!!!!!

      It’s true. MRUTYNJAY has a fantastic and touching story.
      Where was arjuna’s dharma when he killed Karna’s unarmed 10 yr old boy sudama when he tried to make peace during draupadi’s swayamvara?
      Where was Arjuna’s dharma when he killed Shon, Karna’s brother after he refused to raise weapons against a charioteer?
      Where was dharma when Arjuna defeated Bhishma using Shikandin (A lady in her prv birth)?It is cheap cowardice.
      Arjuna on top lived the life of Brihanala , as a woman just like Shikandin.
      Karna attacked Abhimanyu after insults from Drona . He insulted Draupadi who was enjoying the fight between the 2 during her swayamvara. (Karna’s broad mind later regrets it and asks forgiveness when Krishna tells him his true parentage)
      Arjuna’s father Indra took advantage of Karna’s generousity and after a series of ill luck , Karna was killed unfairly by Arjuna.
      Karna had defeated even Jarasandha who defeated even Balarama in just hours,that too in a fair fight, one on one only. (while Bhim took 28 days to kill him with Krishna’s help.Arjuna was nowhere near Jarasandha’s power)
      Karna never got justice. But he has proved that in a fair duel he is near invincible and unconquerable with his kavchakundalas.

      1. Also Karna didn’t kill Arjuna when a serpent offered to kill Arjuna while he fainted after being hit by Karna’s arrows ( as per the rules of war a warrior shouldn’t kill another with the help of an animal- Karna decided to follow the rule even after the sufferings Arjun caused him)
        After defeating all the pandavas ,Karna had defeated Arjuna too but didn’t kill him as it was the time of sunset. The next day Arjuna killed Karna disobeying the rules of war.

  20. Mr. Kotian let me quote you ” Mr Niraj,
    First of all I request to you to stop indulging in blaming me for intentionely ignoring true facts of MB. I am displaying knowledge not of my own but purely for Ved Vyasa’s MB. – Let me add Mr. Kotian I am also doing the same. I also have quoted MB. It clearly mentions Karnas bhargavastra and battle day 16th where Karna put Arjuna and all his supporters to flight. You ask that why could not Karna do that at virata yudha. I ask why Arjuna could not defeat Karna on this battle day 16th. You say that these are fake incidences. Yes the chariot moving incident is fake but the bhargava astra incident and battle day 16th incident is quoted in MB. You are accusing Karna supporters of rewriting MB to suit Karna. that even I can say that ARjuna supporters have fabricated to glorify ARjuna. After all the battle of Kurukshetra was of 18th days and Pandavas to suffered heavy losses and had to use deceit a fact which you also have admitted in your postings.
    I have quoted MB where Krishna shows Arjunas chairot burning under the impact of weapons of Karna drona. your statement ” Your Ashwatthama eg is baseless I say as there is no question here of proving superiority” I am 100 percent sure that you have misunderstood my statement as usual. this eg I gave was NOT to prove Ashwatthamas superiority. My purpose was to enlighten you of the fact that a maharathi does NOT need his bow to launch a counter attack hence Karnas cutting abhimanyus bow cannot be a serious offence. I will be the first to agree that Ashwatthama was inferior to both Arjuna and Abhimanyu.

  21. Mr. Kotian. You are displaying knowledge only which is in favour of Pandavas and pretending ignorance of the other part of the story. In tapori language this is called yeda banke peda kha raha hai.
    Your first statement I repeated that Arjuna did not use divine weapons because you yourself have asked that why didnt he use it??. I quoted him not using sammohan vana becase it suited his purpose. he killed Karna with divine weapon anjalika that also suited his purpose. Your repeating false information does not make it truth.
    Ashwatthama used the grass blade and charged it at the Pandavas. So what??? Even Arjuna was capable of doing this. Since he had his bow and arrows, isnt it right on his part to use it??? He too charged the Brahmastra as only a Brahmastra could counter strike an other Brahmastra. There is is nothing down on Arjuna here as he did it in self defence. the ashwatthama eg I gave was to prove that maharathi does not need bow so karna cutting abhimahyus bow cannot be a serious offence as you are claiming. Warrior attack from all angles. see the defination a warrior who can tackle many warriors at a radius of 360 degrees. The feats of Karna which I have recorded are from moola mahabharata translated by sanskrit scholars like K. M. Ganguly and are authentic. Not from some folk lore. You say mahabharata was tampered to unnsecerry glorify karna. that I also can say that it was tampered to unnecessary glorify pandavas. YOu ask a question where were those feats against Abhimanyu. I ask where was Arjunas feats when Drona was playing hell with the pandava army. Drupad and Panchalas also had defeated Karna earlier like abhimayu. But in the battle of kurukshetra they could not defeat karna. That Indrajeet also made Lakshamana unconsious but on another day could not face Lakshamana and got killed.
    Your questuion is as follows ” And of Karna parva which you have described are you sure they are from Ved Vyasa’s work?? These are translations from K. M. Gangulys work of mahabharata which is considered closet to authentic. Not from some folklore. Your refusal to believ truth does not nullify it. Your question is how did Karna lose to Arjuna in the Virat war where the latter is all alone and Karna had all the best maharathis on his side???. The event of virata is as follows. when Duryodhana received infor of keechakas death he reached to the correct conclusion. that bhima must have killed him. He sents susharma the king of trigarta to attack virata. He anticipates that pandavas will come out of their hiding to fight susharma and duryodhanas anticipation was correct except that 4 pandavas came not arjuna as he was disguised as a eunuch. When duryodhana came to attack virata he first stole the cows of the virata. hence this battle is called gorakshan. Now when arjuna came out as uttaras chariot no one was expecting him as no one could have thoght that arjuna was a eunuch. Mr. Kotian when 2 divine weapons clash there is a very harmful effect on the nearby vicinity. this info is reveled in the arjuna ashwatthama brahmastra clash. Hence in this battle Karna cannot have fired divine weapons as cows were there in vicinity. Athough in kurukshetra he fired divine weapons like bhargavastra and nagastras where arjuna cut a sorry figure. Hence at battle of virata Arjuna can be credited with a good victory but not evidence of superiority. the well wishers of Arjuna also knew this. Hence Indra took the kavach from Karna. Your statment. Karna could not rescue Duryodhan from the GAndharvas but in fact escaped to save himself. But Arjuna defeated the Gandharvas and rescued Duryodhan. – yes it mentioned in mb. But firstly rmember on a given day even a novice warrior can defeat a champion warrior. I will show you an instance where Susharma also seriusly injured Arjuna and he was taken to safety by krishna. also in the gandhrava attack Karna was obsessed by the spirit of narkasura. when such things happend to good people they turn selfish. in the story of nala damayanti also this phenomenon happened. In any case realise that Karna killed 10,000 gandharvas and then went. why did the gandharvas allow karna to go after he killed so many of them
    fact is that they too were glad to see him go. Your next question How did Karna lose to Drupad inspite of being accompanied with 100 Kauravas and Hastinapur’s army??? Arjuna defeated and captured Drupad with only 4 brothers on his side. – Remember dronas instructions to both the parties. Capture Drupad alive. in other words they cannot kill Drupad. so while fighting drupad Karna or for that matter Drudyodhana cant hit drupad a lethal blow. Whereas drupad on his side did not have any restrictions or bindings on him.
    Hence while fighting Kauravas the power of agression was heavily in drupads favour. In the battle of kurukshtra there were no binding of dronas instructions on Karna hence karna single handed ly destroyed the panchalas. And lastly the numero uno of all your fabrications
    ” Also you have said that the Pandava warriors attacked Karna while he was alone. Yudhisthira atleast wouldnt have done this. — Ha ha thats a laugh. Yudhishthira allowed
    Killing of Drona. foul blow of bhima. bhima stamping on duryodhanas head. so please dont indulge in false glorification. those feats of karna I have recorded are from KM. Gangulys moolas mahabharata. MB says Arjuna had single handedly defated Karna with many warriors YES but MB also says that Karna too had achieved the same feat. Its just that you beleive those parts which you like and those which you dont like you say are not authentic. I have quoted from KM ganguly the sanskrit shcolare whose MB
    is closet to accuracy.

    1. Mr Niraj,
      Firs of all I request to you to stop indulging in blaming me for intentionely ignoring true facts of MB. I am displaying knowledge not of my own but purely for Ved Vyasa’s MB. Yor Ashwatthama eg is baseless I say as there is no question here of proving superiority. I repeat that Arjuna too could use the blade of grass. He learnt all divyastras use from Drona and his 5 yrs stay in heaven. Ashwatthama was way behind Arjuna in these aspects. And a maharathi does not depend on divyastras. What makes a maharathi is his might, courage, skills and baahubal.
      Depending on divine weapons is no way one can prove himself a maharathi. Arjuna tells this thing to Yudhistira and Uttar too. Jo veer hote hai woh apni baahubal se yudh karte hai, tapasya nahi.

      Of KArna. Attacking from behind is not only against the war code but also a sign of cowardice or weakness.This is mentioned in MB and Ramayan too.Pls check this if you dont beleive. Karna asked Drona as how to defeat Abhimanyu as it was not possible for anyone to defeat him in a fair war. Drona tells him to break his bow from behind. Karna does it without Abhimanyu’s notice. Does it not prove cheating here ??? And what is attacking from behind without the opponents notice??? If not weakness then what else can it be called????? Karna was defeated front facing Abhimanyu.
      And I have not lied of MB being tampered. It is fact. Many people have created their own version of MB after Vyasa’s MB and exaggerated so many things which have no mention in the Puranas. “Like Karna pushing Arjuna’s chariot 10 feet away and Arjuna meeting Hanuman.” Needless to say the same things have happened with Ramayana too.
      You tell me that I refuse to believe your Karna facts. I will believe to each and every fact of yours if they are form the Puranas.

      You have not answered of Karna’s valor front of Abhimanyu.
      I agree that Drona was powerful than Arjuna. Arjuna was quite many times defeated by Drona. Yes I do agree this. But the same Arjuna defeated Drona while he tried to capture Yudhistira alive and also in the Virat war.
      And your wrong info that Karna and the mahrathis didnt know that the eunuch was ARjuna. The fact was that they initially didnt know who he was. Later Arjuna gave a loud twang from his Gandiva bow and blew his conch loudly. All the warriors on the either side recognised Arjuna due to this. Duryo tells the acharyas that they have recognised Arjuna and that their 12 yrs exile should be started again. The acharya telll that it is over. Here Karna supports Duryoudhans statement that they have recognised the Pandavas. And how did you tell that No one knew Arjuna??? Arjuna shoots 3 arrows front of the acharyas and greets them after which the war follows. Here Karna is defeated twice by Arjuna. Arjuna uses no divine weapons here while the war is going on. Whats more, he defeats even the great Bhishma and Drona. Who else can ever do this?????? Arjuna’s superiority is proven here.

      In the Gandharva war, if Karna killed so many of them, why did he have to escape??? How did he leave Duryodhan in danger??? Karna had even Dushasan on his side with soldiers. How did Arjuna rescue Duryodhan with only Bhima on his side???

      On the Drupad episode, Drona had instructed to get him captured alive. But the fact is that there is no question of Drona’s instructions. If Karna and the others failed to to do this, Arjuna did with only 4 bros on his side. Lethal blow is which no one has done. Only a fair war is fought in which Arjuna succeeds. The Kauravas their soldiers and Karna get overpowered by the Panchalas and retreat. Not in the case with only 5 Pandavas.

      Foul blow of bhima: Yes I agree but till then the war was fought equally Bhima took an oath to destroy Duryo’s thigh as it was a proof for his love for Draupadi. Didnt he compelte his oath?? Didnt Duryo heap insult on Draupadi??

      You are accusing Bhima of stamping on the head. Tell me here what not wrongs have Duryo not done to the Pandavas???? I fully back Bhima here.

      I am not unauthentic as you say. I believe facts purely based on the Puranas
      Not those who have added their own minds or mixed the original works as there are who have done. The Puranic facts have been written by Sages who had divine vision.

  22. I consider Arjuna to be the worst character in Mahabharata and a bad example of a human being and here’s why:

    Today Hinduism/Indian culture is bashed by non-Hindus/non-Indians especially missionaries on two main issues – Treatment of women and Caste/Tribal discrimination. Arjuna practiced both caste/tribal discrimination and treated women badly.

    Most of the characters of Mahabharata are guilty of this but the reason why I’m singling out Arjuna is because he has been glorified excessively for being noble/heroic/manly when he clearly wasn’t. Even worse, excuses have been made for his actions.

    Caste/Tribal Discrimination:
    1) He was happy when Ekalavya lost his thumb.
    2) He constantly called Karna a sutputra.
    3) He burned to death Naga tribals including women and children at Khandav forest. (So much for so called rules of war)
    4) He got Naga tribal Uloopi pregnant and then left her instead of supporting her like a man.

    Treatment of women:
    1) He was lusting after Draupadi at the same time as his brothers. (Mahabharata clearly describes ALL five brothers thinking of her at night just before her swayamvara)
    2) He then shared Draupadi with his brothers.
    3) He burned to death Naga tribals including women and children at Khandav forest. (So much for so called rules of war)
    4) He got Naga tribal Uloopi pregnant and then left her instead of supporting her like a man.
    5) He got Chitrangadha pregnant and then left her instead of supporting her like a man.
    6) He eloped with Subhadra instead of asking for hand like a man.
    7) He then presents her as a milkmaid to Draupadi instead of introducing her properly.
    8) He stayed quiet when Draupadi was dragged by her hair and disrobed.
    9) He then prevented Bhima from killing Duryodhan and Dushasana then and there.
    10) During Gita he mentions women becoming corrupted/loose, etc when the men are dead.
    11) He didn’t bring his cousin sister Dushalla back home during Ashwamedh, after her son committed suicide. He just left her.
    12) Worst of all he abandoned Krishna’s female family members when they were kidnapped by robbers/tribals. He didn’t go down fighting to save their honour. He didn’t call for reinforcements. He didn’t even go back with an army for search and rescue. (This makes him the biggest coward and ungrateful in my opinion)

    I can think of even more reasons for other issues as well.

    1. Almost all your comments dont carry weight or genuine reason.

      Arjuna kept quiet during Draupadi s time as he himlslf was lsost to Duryo and became his slave as per the rule of the game. But Arjuna later vowed to kill Karna.
      It was Arjuna who pledged to kill Karna that time front of everyone. It was Arjuna who rescued Drupadi from Jaydrath.

      Arjuna was not happy after Eklavyas finger was cut. Some ignorant fellow must have said this. He burnt the Khandav forest as he wanted to help a fire god to devour the forest to satisfy his hunger. Also there were many criminals and ghosts hiding in that forest. It was dangerous for anyone to roam there.
      Arjuna had no time for Uloopi. He had other tasks too. He was in exile and also was busy with his brothers and other work.

      Arjuna shared Draupadi is nothing wrong here. All the bros vowed that they will share with each other whatever they get. In her past life, Draupadi was blessed by Lord Shiva that she will get 5 great and powerful husbands. So in this birth, the boon took place . Whats wrong here????

      The Subhadra episode has a different story. Pls check it out. It was a custom for a kshatriya to either win her hand or elop her. Arjuna could not have a swayamvar as Balrama wanted Subhadra to marry Duryodhan whic Subhadra didnt want.She liked Arjuna and waited for Arjuna to carry her.

      WHhoever calls Arjuna a coward is totally ignorant and has hatred o i say simply nullyfying facts. Who in the world says that Arjuna is a coward??? He is one of the best heroes to be ever born in earth. He was peerless and feared none!!!!!!!!!!!!

      1. Yeah right. I advise you to read the Mahabharata with a logical mind and not believe everthing blindly.

        As to your points:

        YOUR ANSWER:
        Arjuna kept quiet during Draupadi s time as he himlslf was lsost to Duryo and became his slave as per the rule of the game. But Arjuna later vowed to kill Karna.
        It was Arjuna who pledged to kill Karna that time front of everyone.
        MY ANSWER:
        That is a pathetic excuse. He wasn’t physically bound by a rope or anything. Nothing was stopping him from using his sword out to cut off Karna’s head. To hell with a stupid rule – his wife was about to be stripped naked in public. If he and Bhim killed Karna and Duryodhana then and there then millions of soldiers would not have lost their lives unnecessarily.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        It was Arjuna who rescued Drupadi from Jaydrath.
        MY ANSWER:
        Good point, but I didn’t mention Jayadrath. However if they used their brains in the first place then they wouldn’t be in that situation.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        Arjuna was not happy after Eklavyas finger was cut. Some ignorant fellow must have said this.
        MY ANSWER:
        It’s from the Mahabharata versions by Kisari Mohan Ganguli and Kamala Subramaniam. Read them.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        He burnt the Khandav forest as he wanted to help a fire god to devour the forest to satisfy his hunger. Also there were many criminals and ghosts hiding in that forest. It was dangerous for anyone to roam there.
        MY ANSWER:
        This is a pathetic excuse used to cover up what really happened. The Pandavas needed land to build a new city and they needed to clear the forest simple. The Mahabharata versions by Kisari Mohan Ganguli and Kamala Subramaniam clearly describe how Asvasena a young Naga boy was helped by his mother to escape the fire. She sacrificed herself so he could escape. The authors didn’t want to make Arjuna look bad so they turned the Naga tribals into magical snakes. Also there are no such things as ghosts.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        Arjuna had no time for Uloopi. He had other tasks too. He was in exile and also was busy with his brothers and other work.
        MY ANSWER:
        Yeah right. Even when Indraprasth was established? She wasn’t even invited to Abhimanyu’s wedding. She’s not even mentioned again untill she saves Arjuna’s life during the Ashvamedh. If he’s in exile then he shouldn’t go around sleeping with women if he can’t take responsibility for his actions.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        Arjuna shared Draupadi is nothing wrong here. All the bros vowed that they will share with each other whatever they get. In her past life, Draupadi was blessed by Lord Shiva that she will get 5 great and powerful husbands. So in this birth, the boon took place . Whats wrong here????
        MY ANSWER:
        The Mahabharata versions by Kisari Mohan Ganguli and Kamala Subramaniam clearly describe how ALL five brothers were thinking of Draupadi at night just before her swayamvara. It is so obvious that all the brothers wanted her which is why they shared her. That is sick. The authors didn’t want to make the Pandavas look bad so they added the bit about Lord Shiva so no-one would question.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        The Subhadra episode has a different story. Pls check it out. It was a custom for a kshatriya to either win her hand or elop her. Arjuna could not have a swayamvar as Balrama wanted Subhadra to marry Duryodhan whic Subhadra didnt want.She liked Arjuna and waited for Arjuna to carry her.
        MY ANSWER:
        In that case Arjuna showed disrespect to his elder brothers Balrama and Duryodhana. If he really liked her then he would have asked for her hand instead of running away or she would have chosen him at a swayamvara. Also the whole concept of swayamvara and eloping was stupid. According to this defence expert, this is what kept Indian kingdoms divided and I agree with him.


        If Arjuna was such a brilliant military leader he would have asked for her hand instead.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        WHhoever calls Arjuna a coward is totally ignorant and has hatred o i say simply nullyfying facts. Who in the world says that Arjuna is a coward???
        MY ANSWER:
        I do and so do lots of other people who can think logically and who don’t believe everything they read.

        YOUR ANSWER:
        He is one of the best heroes to be ever born in earth. He was peerless and feared none!!!!!!!!!!!!
        MY ANSWER:
        Is that why he abandoned Krishna’s female family members when they were kidnapped (possibly even raped) by robbers/tribals? Is that why he didn’t even dare to go back with an army for search and rescue?

        1. Not all your comments are true.
          Make sure what you are saying are from Vyasa’a work . So many writers and scholars out there have made their own MB. Make sure what you say are from the Puranas.
          Not inviting Uloopi does not show any inferiority of Arjuna here. Thay lived far apart. Arjuna was never idle and was all time busy with his weapons, bros and other tasks too. Your comment of sharing Draupadi is too too sick and pathetic. Pandavas did swear to share what they got. No ?? of anything ridiculous here.

          There is nothing stupid here. Subadra eloped out of her own wish. Arjuna could have won her by swaymwar if he was determined to do so.

          Criticizers of Arjuna are too narrow in their outllook I say. WHy can they elaborate what good and heroic deeds Arjuna did??? They are countless of such things and these people cant stand it. They find lame excuses of throwing Arjuna in a poor light. They say things illogically and simply dont want to beleive true facts.

          1. Sorry but I disagree with you. I have already given my reasons, and the incidents I quoted are from Kisari Mohan Ganguly’s translated Mahabharata which is recognised by as being authentic. The other source I used is Kamala Subramaniam’s abridged Mahabharata which is also considered close to authentic. Both of which are recognised by the Bharathy Vidya Bhavan.

            And no offence to you but you are sounding like a Muslim who refuses to acknowledge that Muhammed commited war crimes or a Christian who denies the Goa inquisition.

            If it is Lord Rama or Lord Krishna who are glorified then I understand and accept.

            But I refuse to accept false glorification of an ordinary human being like Arjuna, especially when the incidents show that he was basically an {MASKED-1ST-WARNING}.

    2. I am sorry but you are too ignorant to warrant a full reply.
      All I will say is
      * Ulupi was a self sufficient princess who didn’t need or want support from Arjun. Remember – she took him to her world – not the other way around. Not all societies were male dominated at the time.
      * Chitrangada was a princess in her own rights and they had a premarital agreement that any child of that marriage will remain in Manipur. Arjun was simply there to provide a legitimate heir to Manipur.
      * Abducting maidens was an accepted way of showing love amongst warrior clans in those days.
      * As for Dushal – why would Arjun want to bring Dushala to the Ashwamedha? Her husband had tried to kidnap his wife. Her brothers had brought misery to his family for countless decades. Her parents were still an expensive burden on the Pandavas – wasting their wealth in giving charity for dead sons. WHY oh WHY would Arjun want to add Dushal to the mix back at Hastinapur?

      Anyway – as I said – your post is too mean spirited to warrant a detailed reply.

  23. Mr. Kotian. I don’t think you have understood my posting. Let me analyze your posting
    “ If he has to prove superiority over Arjuna, he should fight him in a fair war” that’s my point he wanted to prove himself superior to Arjuna hence he cannot be party to any concocted plan to get Arjuna killed by any other means and cant be blamed. You say Bheeshma deserved respect and ask a question how come Kripacharya has bad character. No where I have said that Bheeshma does not deserve respect or Kripacharya has bad character but they have done controversial things in their life. Kripacharya joined hands with Ashwatthama to kill innocent people after the war including Draupadis 5 sons just for personal vendetta. Duryodhan was on his death bed and the war was already over. It was not only the foetus but they killed the sons of draupadi while they were sleeping. Please understand this. Your statement that Ashwatthama killed only foetus is fabricated statement. Your feeble attempt to defend Bhima by saying Bhima was sure tough talker but sided dharma and virtue is nothing but false glorification sharp words are also capable to hurt helpless people bad real bad. Bhimas behavior or rather misbehavior with the blind couple is inacceptable. You say Bhima sided with Dharma and virtue. Siding with dharma and virtue and individuals character are different aspects. Drupad sided with dharma betrayed drona. Drona sided with adharma but was loyal to dhitharashtra who appointed him guru of the princes and helped him financially. Today coaches of India receive Dronacharya award. Its Drona who is glorified. There is no Drupad award. Siding with dharma point is also non contextual. What made stalwarts like Bheeshma, Drona and Karna side with Duryodhana was a philosophy. They knew that Duryodhana was evil.

    1. The actual war was not over as many people think. The reality of the war was Duryoyodhan and he himself said that until he is alive the war will go on. The war could end only on his death.
      So Ashwatthama waited till he could kill the Pandavas till his death. And you blame him for killing those innocent 5 children of Pandavas is also non contextual. Ashwatthama didnt know that they were actually the son’s of Pandavas due to the darkness at night. He killed them thinking to be the Pandavas. His thinking had a genuine reason too. Remember how the Pandavas cunningly killed his father by uttering a terrible lie. Drona laid down his arms and sat in meditation. And was beheaded in the presence of Pandavas. Duryodhan’s deceitful defeat added more anger. Was it not deceit of the Pandavas?? Was it not natural for Ashwatthama to take vengeance???

      And Bhima did not misbehave with the blind couple as you say. He spoke harshly only with Dhritarashtra and not Gandhari. Was it not provoking though??

      Dhritarashtra many times sided Duryodhan’s adharmic ways knowingly too. Pandavas knew about this. Game of dice, Draupadi’s disrobing, another dice game, 12 years exile, agyaat vaas were taken place in Dhritarashtra’s presence inspite of being a king. Due to too much attachment for his son, he did not stop his son from doing his wicked ways. Bhima knew all this. Was it not right for Bhima to blame the king???? He with his brothers suffered a lot because of this. Bhima was right in making the king realise his folly. Anyone else too would have done the same. Isnt it???

      Bhishma and Drona were helpless as they ate the salt of Hastinapur but their blessings of victory were towards the pandavas. They did not bless Duryodhan.

      And you say siding with dharma is non contextual. How come??? Dharma is what makes a good human being to the society. The pandavas would not have tolerated disrobing of any women(excluding Draupadi incident). Unlike Karna who was shamelessly smiling at Draupadi’s disrobing.

      1. Mr. Kotian. Firstly I would request you to stop behaving like a womans rights acitivist who thinks that injustice is something happens only when a woman is suffering from unethical behavior. Adharma ya kapat kapat hi hota hai chaahe voh kisi ke saath kiya gaya ho. Man ya woman. Let me quote you “ So Ashwatthama waited till he could kill the Pandavas till his death. And you blame him for killing those innocent 5 children of Pandavas is also non contextual. Ashwatthama didnt know that they were actually the son’s of Pandavas due to the darkness at night. He killed them thinking to be the Pandavas. His thinking had a genuine reason too. Remember how the Pandavas cunningly killed his father by uttering a terrible lie. Drona laid down his arms and sat in meditation. And was beheaded in the presence of Pandavas.” Jaan ke khushi hui ki pandava ke kapat or deceit ko acknowledge kiya gaya hai. Your second quote “The pandavas would not have tolerated disrobing of any women(excluding Draupadi incident).” Ha ha this is the numero uno of all fabrications. Pandavas did nothing when their own wife whom they loved was getting disrobed and tolerated. Is baat ki kya guarantee ha that they would not tolerate this in future for a wife of a person whom they hate. In any case using would have could have is not substantial proof. Its more assuming or concluding. That even I can say Karna would never cut an arm of a warrior something which Arjuna did to Bhurishrava. Bhishma and Drona did not bless Duryodhana. Karna on his part also did not capture Yudhishthira alive and end the war when he had the chance. He too contributed to dharma. I will get back to Bhimas misbehavior. What Dhritarashtra did was wrong but what Bhima did was also wrong 2 wrongs dont make a right.

        1. First of all I do not know whether you have respect/ soft corner for the dignity of a woman. Else you wouldn’t have said that way. And it is baseless on your part for dragging the “woman activist” thing here.Whatever the fact, tolerating injustice on women is truly unvirtue and ill.

          And its totally rubbish comment of yours that there is no guarantee that Pandavas would have saved any other woman. I agree they did nothing during the Draupadi incident. Bhima was about to stop that but he was stopped by Yudhistira that time. The thing was they themselves lost to the dice game and became slaves of Duryodhan as per the rules.
          They may have done nothing but wasnt it Bhima who tore Dushasan’s chest, broke his arm and killed him?? Did not he brutally kill Duryodhan too??? Its because he swore to do that after they did that to Draupadi. This shows he loved her dearly. Arjuna too boiled with anger for Draupadi.
          How can you say that Pandavas would not save any other woman?? I believe they would have. They were virtueos, dharmic, devotees and pure hearted. How can anyone blame them for your so called ” no guarantee” thing????

          Let me also tell you that it was Bhima and Arjuna who rescued Draupadi from Jaydrath. It was Bhima who brutally killed Kichak and an Asura Jatasura after they tried to molest Draupadi. Can you still give any explanation???? They never tolerated any trouble on Drupadi.

          And of Arjuna cutting Bhurishravas arm. BHurishrava was fighting Satyaki. The latter was weaponless and injured and not in conscience. Still Bhurishrav came to kill him which was against not only dharma but also the war code. To save Satyaki from this adharmic and treachorous way, was it not fair on Arjuna’s part to cut off that arm. Bhurishrav was with a weapon too. So there was no foul play on Arjuna here.
          And of Karna, did not he participate int treachorus and cowardly manner of killing Abhimanyu??? He broke Abhimanyu’s bow from behind which was against the war code. Later he joined the others in killing that lone, weaponless, injured warrior who was also devoid of armour.

          Drona himself was unable to capture Yudhistir alive due to Arjuna’s presence. Let alone KArna and the others.

          1. I will answer your question because remaining is your personal opinion. “ whether you have respect/ soft corner for the dignity of a woman. Else you wouldn’t have said that way. .Whatever the fact, tolerating injustice on women is truly unvirtue and ill.
            Ans: I have a respect and soft corner for dignity ethics for all human beings. Anyay ek aise cheez hai jo kisi ke saath nahin hona chahiye. Tolerating injustice on any one is a no – no. Whether its Draupadi Drona or Eklavya or.any one else. Your points on Bhima and Arjuna protecting Draupadi were well made. However I might add your comment on Karna – Abhinayu scene is a total crap. If you are lacking in information please don’t speculate. If you read the Mahabharata properly you will realize that a maharathi does not need his bow to launch a counter attack. When Pandavas attacked Ashatthama at vedvyasas ashrama Ashwatthama did not have a bow to start with. He took a blade of grass converted it into an astra and fired it. So please realize that cutting a bow even from behind cannot be a serious offence. The killing of Abhimanyu was done by Dushasanas son not by Karna as shown in B.R. Chopras serial. Coming to Bhurishrava yes he was doing something unethical but Arjuna being an expert bow was more than capable of knocking he bow out of his hand or firing sammohan vana and temporarily stunning him. Cripling him from behind is also wrong and 2 wrongs don’t make a right. When Satyaki recovered he killed the crippled Bhurisharava that too when he was in meditation. Why didn’t Arjuna chastisize him then. Let alone stopping him. The Pandavas deceit in Dronas killing has already been admitted by you in your previous posting.

          2. Mahabharata war was a battlefield. It wasn’t a mediation seminar. Anyone who came there with weapons on their had better be ready for a fight. Even non-combatants like charioteers were regularly attacked, so Drona, Bhurishrava could not expect others to stop attacking them just because they had no weapons on them.
            Even Arjun gave up his weapons and picked them up again at the start of the battle. This was a battlefield, a warrior may rest his weapons or sit and think for any number of reasons. While he was on the battlefield, he was a legitimate target. To sit in the middle of a battle and presume people will know he has retired from it is expecting too much. There was no weapon or mantra that allowed you to read the mind of your enemies. How were people suppose to know Drona or Bhurishrava had suddenly retired from battle for good ? If they were so inclined, they could have told their charioteer to take them back to their tent. If a warrior wants to retire from battle, he should leave the field. No one would attack him leaving the battle field.

        2. Dude, anyone who suffered for as long as the Pandavas did, would have been perfectly excused for kicking Duryodhan’s head after his defeat. Duryodhan was the architect of the whole massacre and deserved far worse than what he got.
          Anyone who thinks supporting or standing up for Draupdi is being a women’s rights’ activist, had better examine their own humanity and realize that rape and incitement to rape are both heinous crimes.

      2. Ashwathama was a wicked coward that’s why he tried to kill Pandavas and their army while they slept. Whether he knew they were Pandavas or not, he committed a terrible war crime killing sleeping warriors. Worse – he tried to kill an unborn baby. He didn’t know if it was male or female, and yet he tried to kill it out of spite. He was pure evil.

        All this about salt eating and loyalty is rubbish. Dharma is dharma and adharma is adharma. If as elders you can’t speak the truth, what is the point of you being appointed to that exulted post ?
        If the Kuru elders were so concerned about salt-eating-loyalty, they could have abdicated from war and told Duryodhan to battle it out himself. Afterall, Dhritarastra was the ruler, not Duryodhan. As Dhritarastra had said he desired peace but Duryodhan wasn’t listening to him, than, as loyal Kuru courtiers, they should have forced Duryodhan to obey, or imprison him or abstained from war.
        Because the kuru elders did not do their job – dharma – Krushna asked Arjun to kill them off because they were siding with adharma. Those who obstruct dharma or support adharma, are equally guilty and God has no compulsion to protect them.
        Aiding and abetting crime is punishable by law even now.

  24. Karna dosent desreve much praise for his goodness. Why did he give the idea of disrobing Panchali??? Why did he not condemn Duryo for burning the Pandavas in the wax palace????

    1. Arjuna was the greatest hero of mb. No one can challange that. In Mahabharata every one has fallen from grace in some way or the other. For eg Bhima. After the war he kept misbehaving with the blind couple. He infact gave a detailed account of how he killed all the kauravas in dhritharashtras and gandharis presence knowing how painful it would be for them to hear about it. Coming to Panchali the people who hurt her most were not Duryodhana or Karna it was Ashwatthama and Kripacharya a Saintly man who was well respected by Pandavas. These 3 had got her sons killed.
      Karna was under Duryodhanas debt. Duryodhana who did not take the advice of bheeshma guru drona do you think he will listen to Karna.? Duryodhana had befriended Karna for help in battle with Pandavas not take sermons from him.
      So Karna reprimanding Duryodhana for lakshagraha is noncotextual.

      1. Whatever, but tolerating adharma is bad anyway. Wax palace episode was tragic. But Karna tolerating this was almost as siding adharma. Duryo and Karna hurted Panchali the most. It was Karna who gave the idea to disrobe her and Duryodhana who ordered it. Ashwatthama respected Draupadi and condemend the Kauravas for her insult before the Virat war.

        1. Yes Tolerating adharma is bad. Bhishma also did that. So many of adharmas of Kauravas took place in his presence. Still in the end he was venerated by both Sri Krishna and Pandavas. The vastrahana is a black mark on Karnas character. There is a black mark on everybody’s character. Harping on Karnas insult to Draupadi does not nullify the black marks of Kripacharya, Ashwatthama, Bhima and others. Understand the psychology of Karna. He wanted to prove he was better than Arjuna. If Arjuna dies in wax palace then how he gets to prove that he is better archer than Arjuna ?. Hence its common sense that Karna was not a willing party to wax palace.

          1. Does Karna have to wait for Arjuna to die in the wax palace???
            That’s, not a warrior’s way. If he has to prove superiority over Arjuna, he should fight him in a fair war.

            Bhishma deserved a lot of respect. He was a great man. How come Kripachary has a bad character ??? Ashwatthama did that bad act of killing a foetus. But apart from that he was a good person. Even after his father’s death, he told Duryodhan to make peace with the Pandavas.

            Bhima was sure tough talker but sided dharma and virtue.

      2. Your comment of Karna attacking from behind a crap??? I have read Ved Vyasa’a Mahabharat carefully. He has stated that it was impossible for the Kaurava heroes to kill Abhimanyu fairly. Drona told Karna to break Abhimanyu’s bow Karna did this by going behind. Drona later broke Abhimayu’s shield and sword. In this way Abhimanyu was armourless and weaponless.

        Abhimanyu was still invincible and kept attacking the enemies. But he was overpowered by the growing onslaught. He was already injured and alone unlike the KAurava warriors. Karna, Drona, Dushasan and his son, Kripa, Kritavarma, Ashwatthama surrounded the boy and attacked him fiercely even though they were being harrased by him. He killed many soldiers by broken wheel. It was Dushasan’s son who gave a fatal blow on Abhimanyu’s head by a mace from behind. Here isn’t Karna not alone???? The Abhimanyu killing will be featured tommorow at Star Utsav at 5.00pm. I too have seen that but it was not that way. Dushasan’s son killed him by the mace by striking it behind the head which killed Abhimanyu. But Karna was a party in accompanying the warriors against a lone hero.

        Pandavas did not attack Ashwatthama as you said. They were about to attack him but Ashwatthama let loose the Brahmastra.

        I agree that Arjuna did not reprimand Satyaki for his deceitful killing but Arjuna did what was right at the nick of time as he came there too late and was necessary to save Satyaki. Arjuna did not use any samohan astra as he avoided the use of divine weapons in the war.

        1. Mr. Kotian. Statements of invincibility have been attributed to Karna as well. That too by none less than Sri Krishna Bheeshma and Arjuna himself as regards Karnas Bhargava astras
          I too have read the Mahabharata. About your statement “ Arjuna did not use any samohan astra as he avoided the use of divine weapons in the war.” Is statement ki kachoomar main nikal chika hoon. Why you keep indulging in this fabrication I just fail to understand.
          However way the Pandavas attacked Ashatthama is non contextual. Main thing is Ashwatthama was unarmded and he picked up a twig and charged it with brahmastra. Hence a supreme warrior does not need his bow. Point well made hence cutting bow does cannot be a serous offence. Many warriors attacking one warrior was of common occurrence those days. Swami Vivekananda also has mentioned this in his teachings of Hindu religion. And in any case a maharathi is a warrior who can handle N number of warriors at a radius of 360 degrees. However Abhimanyu was wounded. So yes I admit it was unfair but don’t forget it was Drona who was incharge of chakravyooha not Karna. In fact in Karna parva not a single warrior was killed unfairly.
          below is the quote from MB which I will be quoting which shows many warriors attacking Karna.

          Below is proof ie battle on 1st day of Karna parva

          Arjuna, cutting off his adversary’s bow and driver and steeds and standard with seven shafts, next cut off his umbrella with one arrow. Obtaining then an opportunity, he sped at Duryodhana an excellent shaft, capable of taking the life of the person struck. Drona’s son, however, cut off that shaft into seven fragments. Cutting off then the bow of Drona’s son and slaying the four steeds of the latter with his arrow, the son of Pandu next cut off the formidable bow of Kripa too. Then cutting off the bow of Hridika’s son, he felled the latter’s standard and steeds. Then cutting off the bow of Duhshasana, he proceeded against the son of Radha. At this, Karna, leaving Satyaki quickly pierced Arjuna with three arrows and Krishna with twenty, and Partha again ( the word again written after Partha is proof that the partha here is Arjuna NOT any other son of Kunti ) repeatedly. Although many were the arrows that he shot while slaying his foes in that battle, like Indra himself inspired with wrath, Karna yet felt no fatigue. ( here its evident that Karna is getting better of Arjuna ) Meanwhile Satyaki, coming up, pierced Karna with nine and ninety fierce arrows, and once more with a hundred. ( Here its clearly evident that satyaki rescued arjuna as Arjuna was repeatedly pierced by Karna when another warrior intervenes between the fight the man whom he is attacking is obviously in advantageous situation. See Ashatthama intervening to protect Duryodhana who was in trouble while battling Arjuna. Lord Rama also attacked Vali when Vali was thrashing Surgreeva. Hence its clear that when Karna was fighting at his best he was indeed equal or perhaps superior to Arjuna. In the final battle also he had rendered Arjuna unconscious before the curses took over ). Then all the foremost heroes among the Parthas ( Parthas means sons of Kunti and Arjun is definitely included here. He cannot have been somewhere else because Its just been shown him being pierced by Karna just moments ago ) began to afflict Karna. Yudhamanyu and Shikhandi and the sons of Draupadi and the Prabhadrakas, and Uttamauja and Yuyutsu and the twins and Dhrishtadyumna, and the divisions of the Cedis and the Karushas and the Matsyas and Kaikeyas, and the mighty Chekitana, and king Yudhishthira of excellent vows, all these, accompanied by cars and steeds and elephants, and foot-soldiers of fierce prowess, encompassed Karna on all sides in that battle, and showered upon him diverse kinds of weapons, addressing him in harsh words and resolved to compass his destruction. (MR KOTIAN SEE HOW MANY WARRIORS ARE ATTACKING KARNA. Satyaki made the first move to rescue Arjuna and he was filled by a crowd of maharathis attacking Karna ) Cutting off that shower of weapons with his sharp shafts, Karna dispersed his assailants by the power of his weapons like the wind breaking down the trees that stand on its way. Filled with wrath, Karna was seen to destroy car-warriors, and elephants with their riders, and horses with horse-men, and large bands of foot-soldiers. Slaughtered by the energy of Karna’s weapons, almost the whole of that force of the Pandavas, deprived of weapons, and with limbs mangled and torn, retired from the field. Then Arjuna, smiling the while, baffled with his own weapons the weapons of Karna
          ( okay fine here arjuna makes a recovery but please realize that it took many warriors up there to subdue Karna after satyaki rescued Arjuna )

          1. I repeated that Arjuna did not use divine weapons because you yourself have asked that why didnt he use it??
            Ashwatthama used the grass blade and charged it at the Pandavas. So what??? Even Arjuna was capable of doing this. Since he had his bow and arrows, isnt it right on his part to use it??? He too charged the Brahmastra as only a Brahmastra could counter strike an other Brahmastra. There is is nothing down on Arjuna here as he did it in self defence.

            And I have not accused Karna of cutting Abhimanyu’s bow as it is allowed and a common thing among warriors. What I said is attacking from behind is totally against the rules of warfare. KArna attacked from behind as told by Drona. WHy couldnt Karna do it front facing Abhimanyu???

            Of Karna parva I would say that there were warriors on Arjuna’s side. Karna defeated all of them.KArna was too invincible I agree but the feats which you have described, Where were they during his fight against Abhimanyu???
            Abhimanyu too did all those what you mentioned of KArna. He alone killed thousands of warriors. He alone defeated Karna, Drona, Ashwatthama, Kripa, Kritavarma, Duryodhan, Dushasan, Bhrihadvala, Shakuni, Salya not only in archery but also in sword fight(after his bow was cut), mace fight and later when he was weaponless, he fought all of them unarmed while his legs were in the air so as to appear he had wings. Abhimanyu attacked so fiercely that he put Karna and his supporters to flight. If there was a single duel only between Karna and Abhimanyu things would be different.

            And of Karna parva which you have described are you sure they are from Ved Vyasa’s work?? Because after his MB, many scholars and people have created their own MB adding many of their own ideas. Many of them were fans of Karna who have exaggerated Karna’s generous and valorous qualities. One among them being that Karna shot an arrow which pushed Arjuna’s chariot 10 feet away. And Krishna asks him that how was it possible with He Himself as the charioteer and Hanuman on the flag??? These stories have no origin in the Puranas.
            Because if it were so, how did Karna lose to Arjuna in the Virat war where the latter is all alone and Karna had all the best maharathis on his side???
            How did Karna lose to Drupad inspite of being accompanied with 100 Kauravas and Hastinapur’s army??? Arjuna defeated and captured Drupad with only 4 brothers on his side.
            Karna could not rescue Duryodhan from the GAndharvas but in fact escaped to save himself. But Arjuna defeated the Gandharvas and rescued Duryodhan.

            Also you have said that the Pandava warriors attacked Karna while he was alone. Yudhisthira atleast wouldnt have done this.

  25. Arjuna invulnerable without Lord Krishna- these statements are added by Vaishnava traditions to enhance Krishna’s divine status and position.

    If it were so, how did Arjuna defeat Drupad’s massive army without even having met Lord Krishna that time????? He had only his 4 brothers with him while Karna was accompanied with 100 Kauravas and Hastinapur’s army.

    Karna could not rescue Duryodhan from the Gandharvas while Arjuna did this work without Lord Krishna’s presence.

    Arjuna alone defeated Karna and the other maharathis in the Virat war here too without Lord Krishna.

    This clearly proves that Arjuna was without Lord Krishna.